By JULIANA FRANCIS
Mr. Olaolu Adegbite is the Economic and Financial Crimes Commission’s (EFCC) Director of Operations. In this encounter with JULIANA FRANCIS, at a workshop sponsored by the commission, tagged ‘The EFCC’s Workshop on Reporting Economic Crimes,’ held in Ikeja, Lagos State, Adegbite spoke on some burning issues. Excerpt.
What is the role of the media in this anti-graft war?
EFCC will do what it has to do, so also should the media do what it has to do. When we talk of corruption affecting the country, the media is not immune to it. If an individual can come and attempt to bribe an EFCC investigator 15 million dollars, then it’s also possible they can bribe the media. And possible they can attempt to bribe the judiciary? Yes, it is possible! So it’s a discussion for everyone to look at issues and see how we can improve our relationships.
What is happening with trials involving ex-governors? Will they ever been convicted?
Conviction is a very harsh word. EFCC does not convict. Conviction is done by the trial judge. What EFCC has been clamouring for, is that let these cases be decided one way or the other. If somebody is acquitted or discharged, we have a lesson to take away from that, in the mistake we have made in that. We still have a right of appeal. What is going on is that there are a lot of interlocutory applications. There are a lot of criminal objections, which are being run as far as the Supreme Court. We have two of that in the case of Audu of Kogi State. It went as far as Supreme Court, it came down again and we’re starting afresh.
We’re glad with the efforts of Nigerians, in trying to do some judicial sector reforms. Of course it’s going to impact positively with what we are doing at the EFCC. In Federal High courts now, there is direction, in which accelerated hearing would be given to cases of corruption, oil bunkering, terrorism and human trafficking. It’s just starting as the courts just resumed.
I’m sure in the next few months; we’re going to see remarkable difference in the speed with which cases are being heard in courts.
What is your reaction to allegations by some lawyers that the EFCC fails to get convictions on former governors because the commission’s investigators do shoddy investigations?
That’s not true! You just mentioned that cases have been in courts for the past five to 10 years. If there are watery evidences, they would not stall the cases. They would rather let it go, or let it be decided in their favour.
What I suggest is that there are issues. And they are afraid to have full blown trials. Mind you, when a case lasts for 10 years, it’s to the advantage of the defence. Some of the investigators might have died. Some might have retired or move on to the private sector.
Also, we have situations whereby the witnesses are no longer available. That is why this strategy of buying time…but of course it’s not going to work! We’re going to use all the resources at our means to make sure that we get conclusion to all these cases.
Do you support call for special courts, so that such cases could be expediently dealt with?
It’s a constitutional matter. Courts are there. The judiciary is independent. The arrangement we have now, is okay by me. We have designated judges because cases of financial crime are different and complex. The judge must have some special skills and information aside from the law to know and understand why you’re talking about cybercrime or other technical issues. We don’t have any issues with that. In FCT and Lagos, we have designated judges and they’re doing extremely well. I must commend that.
We heard the EFCC is broke. Could it be affecting trial of cases in court?
No! It’s not affecting our cases. And we’re not broke for the second time!
We have so many people in Nigeria, who are so active, but once they go into government work, they become inactive. What makes people inactive as government workers?
That’s a very deep question you’ve asked. What makes us different from other people? We see people who are brilliant, who are stars in their own right, suddenly getting into government and…I would like to attribute that to the social pressure. And talk of the social perpetrator of corruption. In Nigeria, every citizen is an expert in corruption. Discussion of corruption is a national past time after football. But the same people discussing about corruption, want their brothers to come and renovate the church in the village.
They want him to build fountain mosque. They want him to buy big cars. The demand is much. Maybe that is what is fueling this public sector corruption. That’s why I said crowd sourcing, public resistance is the way. One should have people in government, maybe at the political level, at the senior, should I say at the professional level of government like public servant? Please reduce that pressure on them.
Resistance power is different. Some would say no and become unpopular, but some would want to flow and want to satisfy everybody. This is why getting information from private sources is very difficult.
Is it true that cases involving bank MDs, that CBN pays lawyers who handle such cases for EFCC?
CBN is the complainant. They collaborated with the EFCC and gave us some assistance. They gave us technical assistance and assistance in all areas. They’re working with us on this.
If we take a look at the constitution, which are the areas you think should be amended, so that prosecutions of anti-graft cases will be okay.
To me, our laws are perfect as they are.
What is your reaction with the survey carried out by CLEEN Foundation, adding the EFCC as one of the corrupt agencies in the corruption index?
I don’t know who came up with that. I don’t even know the parameter used. Like I told you, some of our adversaries…people we’ve prosecuted are fighting us through crude means and may sending out this sort of information, but I don’t know about that. You have to know that the EFCC has a very strong internal affairs department where our staff is even put under polygraph test. We fight corruption inward and outward. I don’t know how anyone can say that.
Have you been getting enough support from the government in the fight against corruption?
We have the best support we can get. The government is determined to fight corruption. When corruption is fought and fought credibly well, the first beneficiary is the government. This is because we’re saving a lot of crumbs that ordinarily would have been wasted. The Federal Government as I see it is determined to fight corruption. Some of our suspects are children of strong politicians, in the ruling party. If there had been interference, we would not have been able to arrest them.
Are you satisfied with the fact that some ex-governors, who have cases pending in courts, are walking around the streets and splashing money everywhere?
I can’t comment on cases in court. We’re talking about fighting corruption under the rule of law. Mind you, it’s not a fight of revolution, where you go to the streets and start killing people. You have to follow the processes and it takes time. Let us follow the rule of law, that’s the only way. Something happened in the Middle East and if you go there, you’d weep. Is the law going to be perfect, no! Will it take time, yes!
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