As controversy continues to surround the twin explosions which rocked the Creek Road area of Liverpool, Apapa, Lagos State, on June, 25, with some people alleging it was a Boko Haram invasion and another set of people insisting it was a tanker explosion, the Founder of the Oodua People’s Congress (OPC), Dr. Frederick Fasehun has joined in the cat and mouse game. In a chat with JULIANA FRANCIS, Fasehun reveals what he felt was the cause of the explosions. He also speaks about the abduction of over 200 Chibok girls, from their school since April, 2014. Excerpt:
What do you think is happening with the rescue of our Chibok girls? What has become of the international intervention?
I think we treated the matter with some levity. I personally thought we should have negotiated. We should have sorted things out because I believe over 200 girls; removed from a community, means virtually every household would have been affected. If a country is unable to defend its citizenry, then such a country should go back to the drawing board. It’s unfortunate and very embarrassing to Nigeria.
The stature of Nigeria in the international community is such that it would be expected to be capable of defending its citizens. But here we are! Now what we need to do is to regard that Nigeria is at war and we are at war!
We have lost over a thousand people. If we have lost over 2000, 3000 people and we have not declared war; then we are not serious! If we regard ourselves as being at war, then let us go to the table and negotiate, so that this war can come to an end.
I hate to think of what is happening to those children; I hate to think of it. It’s just that people must be decent in their language and use of language. A lot must have happened to those children. I think the leadership of a country should be thinking of doing something about it. That’s one of its primary functions.
What about the white people that came? How come everything became silent?
Terrorism has its own diplomacy. How are you sure that you’re the only diplomatic person in the circumstance? These terrorists also have their own diplomatic influences all over the place. They do.
Why has the international community gone silent and acquiescent? Are they not thinking? We are all citizens of the world, so governments all over the world have the right to intervene and interfere where citizens of other countries are not been treated well and I don’t think citizens of Nigeria have been treated well under the present circumstance.
So, if our government is not going to wake up, I think the international community should wake up. But like I said, maybe diplomacy has swallowed diplomacy.
Do you think Federal Government should have swapped the girls with members of Boko Haram, arrested by security agencies?
Of course it would have helped! Swapping or exchanging citizens across no-man’s border is a common way of settling international crisis. It was done in Korea, South Africa, Kenya and it was done during the last world war.
Exchange citizens and prisoners across noman’s land and that’s what Nigeria should have done and influence the United Nations to come and supervise the exchange.
The exchange of citizens and prisoners or if you like, the international Red Cross should undertake the exchange. I don’t know why Nigeria would not listen to her own citizens that were saying; don’t listen to war mongers and let us dialogue and exchange citizens and prisoners.
How will you react if someone tells you that Boko Haram has invaded Lagos?
I don’t think they have any work to do here (Lagos). Their targets are not situated in this part of the country. But if they try or want to introduce violence into our own community, we’ll use our own method to discourage violence.
Did you hear about the explosions in Apapa?
Yes, we heard about it and we went into it and we found out that it was exploded fuel tanker.
What would OPC do if in the worst case scenarios Boko Haram invades Lagos?
I can assure you that OPC will not shit in its pant if such happens! OPC had been asked not to be violence prone, but that doesn’t say if violence comes into our environment, we will not react to such violence. When violence reacts against violence, peace is the ultimate goal. We’re interested in peace.
How do you react to intelligence reports that Boko Haram is targeting some areas in Lagos, especially Kilometer 47, Lagos/ Ibadan Expressway, where we have different churches and Nasfat?
That will cause religious warfare! The big churches in Nigeria are situated along that axis and I don’t think even the leaders of the churches, peace loving as they would be on the pulpits, will allow the destruction of their congregation with impunity.
Are you saying it can’t happen? This is a sect that had killed several people
Yes! It will not happen!
You said they’ll not invade Lagos because their target is not here. What do you think is their target?
I don’t even know what their target is. I only know and I’m aware of the methods they adopt. I don’t know why they adopt those methods, but they have been adopting those methods within a defined area of this country. I don’t think they would adopt such methods elsewhere. I don’t think so and I know they won’t come to the south west.
What is your advice to security agencies in Nigeria, especially Lagos, incase Boko Haram has such a planned invasion?
There are many things government can do to secure even the whole country; virtually every governor takes security vote every month. What do they spend this security vote on? If what we experience as citizens is insecurity, why should they be given such huge sums of money every month to provide security?
If I had my way, the National Assembly should stop doling out security funds to these governors because they use security funds to enrich themselves, without procuring or providing any form of security.
What the government should do at the federal level is to contract these things out to people who can do it, to companies that can do it. But unfortunately, government is not thinking of it. How on earth do you smuggle two hundred plus children across our border without security operatives being aware? What is going on?
There are now various gadgets to secure our international borders. A particular company came and what they can provide in term of security is phenomenal. Area, land, sea, adopting some forms of cameras. Even CCTV is not a new innovation to them. A CCTV that will follow the terrorist for miles inside its own territory.
Is there any gadget like that?
There is! That’s what I’m telling you! Why it is that Nigeria doesn’t want to utilize such techniques, such technologies? This is an invisible thing and perimeter security. So why are we not adopting these things? I know they say some Chinese company went away with a hundred million or hundred billion naira worth of security contract.
They promised to secure Abuja, using CCTV and they were given a deposit of about a hundred billion and they ran back to their country. Invisible fences are now being used to secure areas.
Nothing stops the local government people or even state government from securing our schools with these types of fences. We’re talking about the local schools and put this type of security around such schools. This vehicle can lay any of these fences round the school whose area of land is one kilometer radius; you can imagine the area of fence it will cover. Why are we not adopting all these?
Are you saying we’re not investing in security?
Yes, we’re not investing in security! And that is why security is nothing to speak about in Nigeria. We are very cheaply secured.
It’s like the Boko Haram members are killing more of our security agents?
We got a report that our security men are killing the Boko Haram. That’s what we got but unfortunately it’s the other way round. There are television sets that now can see 10 kilometers ahead. Why are we not adopting this? Why are we not utilizing such technology? The technology is there.
How will that help?
At least it will help to warn border security that people are planning in their own country and approaching your international border? So you will be alerted long enough for the military to be warned, that something may happen. The world has gone past all these.
Taking security of borders into consideration, how do you think Boko Haram gets guns and materials to make their bombs?
That is why I said, diplomacy has swallowed diplomacy.
So you think a country is giving it to them?
Of course! of course!
A country trying to wipe out Nigeria and Nigerians?
Nigeria doesn’t have too many friends. What we call friends are those friends that are envious of our natural resources and we expose our own security to them, thinking they are our friends. When a country as big as the United States said it openly; that Nigeria would splinter into smithereens. Some of us wondered by what form of wizardry do they come to know this. They have said it, are they working towards the answer? A year before 2015, the magic date, Nigeria is already experiencing, unfriendly demonstrations and so on and so forth.
What is giving you the confidence that Boko Haram will not come into the South West?
People have confidence in the OPC. And the security of a people is directly dependent on the people themselves. When we started off 20 years ago, people didn’t like OPC. But today, virtually everybody that lives in these areas now is a member of the OPC. So that is very good for security.
The security operatives at any moment can warn you and alert that something nasty may come in and since they themselves are involved in that security, they’ll prepare themselves to meet insecurity with security. Well, as somebody directly involved, I shouldn’t speak with too open a mouth. I don’t want to publicize the methods OPC will adopt if anything happens. When we get to that bridge, we’ll cross it.
But in a nutshell, they won’t come?
By the grace of God, they won’t come!
What do you think is happening with the rescue of our Chibok girls? What has become of the international intervention?
I think we treated the matter with some levity. I personally thought we should have negotiated. We should have sorted things out because I believe over 200 girls; removed from a community, means virtually every household would have been affected. If a country is unable to defend its citizenry, then such a country should go back to the drawing board. It’s unfortunate and very embarrassing to Nigeria.
The stature of Nigeria in the international community is such that it would be expected to be capable of defending its citizens. But here we are! Now what we need to do is to regard that Nigeria is at war and we are at war!
We have lost over a thousand people. If we have lost over 2000, 3000 people and we have not declared war; then we are not serious! If we regard ourselves as being at war, then let us go to the table and negotiate, so that this war can come to an end.
I hate to think of what is happening to those children; I hate to think of it. It’s just that people must be decent in their language and use of language. A lot must have happened to those children. I think the leadership of a country should be thinking of doing something about it. That’s one of its primary functions.
What about the white people that came? How come everything became silent?
Terrorism has its own diplomacy. How are you sure that you’re the only diplomatic person in the circumstance? These terrorists also have their own diplomatic influences all over the place. They do.
Why has the international community gone silent and acquiescent? Are they not thinking? We are all citizens of the world, so governments all over the world have the right to intervene and interfere where citizens of other countries are not been treated well and I don’t think citizens of Nigeria have been treated well under the present circumstance.
So, if our government is not going to wake up, I think the international community should wake up. But like I said, maybe diplomacy has swallowed diplomacy.
Do you think Federal Government should have swapped the girls with members of Boko Haram, arrested by security agencies?
Of course it would have helped! Swapping or exchanging citizens across no-man’s border is a common way of settling international crisis. It was done in Korea, South Africa, Kenya and it was done during the last world war.
Exchange citizens and prisoners across noman’s land and that’s what Nigeria should have done and influence the United Nations to come and supervise the exchange.
The exchange of citizens and prisoners or if you like, the international Red Cross should undertake the exchange. I don’t know why Nigeria would not listen to her own citizens that were saying; don’t listen to war mongers and let us dialogue and exchange citizens and prisoners.
How will you react if someone tells you that Boko Haram has invaded Lagos?
I don’t think they have any work to do here (Lagos). Their targets are not situated in this part of the country. But if they try or want to introduce violence into our own community, we’ll use our own method to discourage violence.
Did you hear about the explosions in Apapa?
Yes, we heard about it and we went into it and we found out that it was exploded fuel tanker.
What would OPC do if in the worst case scenarios Boko Haram invades Lagos?
I can assure you that OPC will not shit in its pant if such happens! OPC had been asked not to be violence prone, but that doesn’t say if violence comes into our environment, we will not react to such violence. When violence reacts against violence, peace is the ultimate goal. We’re interested in peace.
How do you react to intelligence reports that Boko Haram is targeting some areas in Lagos, especially Kilometer 47, Lagos/ Ibadan Expressway, where we have different churches and Nasfat?
That will cause religious warfare! The big churches in Nigeria are situated along that axis and I don’t think even the leaders of the churches, peace loving as they would be on the pulpits, will allow the destruction of their congregation with impunity.
Are you saying it can’t happen? This is a sect that had killed several people
Yes! It will not happen!
You said they’ll not invade Lagos because their target is not here. What do you think is their target?
I don’t even know what their target is. I only know and I’m aware of the methods they adopt. I don’t know why they adopt those methods, but they have been adopting those methods within a defined area of this country. I don’t think they would adopt such methods elsewhere. I don’t think so and I know they won’t come to the south west.
What is your advice to security agencies in Nigeria, especially Lagos, incase Boko Haram has such a planned invasion?
There are many things government can do to secure even the whole country; virtually every governor takes security vote every month. What do they spend this security vote on? If what we experience as citizens is insecurity, why should they be given such huge sums of money every month to provide security?
If I had my way, the National Assembly should stop doling out security funds to these governors because they use security funds to enrich themselves, without procuring or providing any form of security.
What the government should do at the federal level is to contract these things out to people who can do it, to companies that can do it. But unfortunately, government is not thinking of it. How on earth do you smuggle two hundred plus children across our border without security operatives being aware? What is going on?
There are now various gadgets to secure our international borders. A particular company came and what they can provide in term of security is phenomenal. Area, land, sea, adopting some forms of cameras. Even CCTV is not a new innovation to them. A CCTV that will follow the terrorist for miles inside its own territory.
Is there any gadget like that?
There is! That’s what I’m telling you! Why it is that Nigeria doesn’t want to utilize such techniques, such technologies? This is an invisible thing and perimeter security. So why are we not adopting these things? I know they say some Chinese company went away with a hundred million or hundred billion naira worth of security contract.
They promised to secure Abuja, using CCTV and they were given a deposit of about a hundred billion and they ran back to their country. Invisible fences are now being used to secure areas.
Nothing stops the local government people or even state government from securing our schools with these types of fences. We’re talking about the local schools and put this type of security around such schools. This vehicle can lay any of these fences round the school whose area of land is one kilometer radius; you can imagine the area of fence it will cover. Why are we not adopting all these?
Are you saying we’re not investing in security?
Yes, we’re not investing in security! And that is why security is nothing to speak about in Nigeria. We are very cheaply secured.
It’s like the Boko Haram members are killing more of our security agents?
We got a report that our security men are killing the Boko Haram. That’s what we got but unfortunately it’s the other way round. There are television sets that now can see 10 kilometers ahead. Why are we not adopting this? Why are we not utilizing such technology? The technology is there.
How will that help?
At least it will help to warn border security that people are planning in their own country and approaching your international border? So you will be alerted long enough for the military to be warned, that something may happen. The world has gone past all these.
Taking security of borders into consideration, how do you think Boko Haram gets guns and materials to make their bombs?
That is why I said, diplomacy has swallowed diplomacy.
So you think a country is giving it to them?
Of course! of course!
A country trying to wipe out Nigeria and Nigerians?
Nigeria doesn’t have too many friends. What we call friends are those friends that are envious of our natural resources and we expose our own security to them, thinking they are our friends. When a country as big as the United States said it openly; that Nigeria would splinter into smithereens. Some of us wondered by what form of wizardry do they come to know this. They have said it, are they working towards the answer? A year before 2015, the magic date, Nigeria is already experiencing, unfriendly demonstrations and so on and so forth.
What is giving you the confidence that Boko Haram will not come into the South West?
People have confidence in the OPC. And the security of a people is directly dependent on the people themselves. When we started off 20 years ago, people didn’t like OPC. But today, virtually everybody that lives in these areas now is a member of the OPC. So that is very good for security.
The security operatives at any moment can warn you and alert that something nasty may come in and since they themselves are involved in that security, they’ll prepare themselves to meet insecurity with security. Well, as somebody directly involved, I shouldn’t speak with too open a mouth. I don’t want to publicize the methods OPC will adopt if anything happens. When we get to that bridge, we’ll cross it.
But in a nutshell, they won’t come?
By the grace of God, they won’t come!
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